[Mb-civic] Go easy on Blair

Fri Jul 8 01:13:23 PDT 2005

Ian & Mr Cheese:

Thank you for yet another reminder of the downside of being a paid soldier; frankly I never understood the upside. 

If we had a chairman, better discipline in the discussion would prevail. So should we restrain ourselves and embrace a discussion using relevance and materiality?

My point of discussion, for which I seek a response is: 

        "Tony Blair is simply the most effective and modern and reliable elected politician in the world today."

I suggest the world standard for such an accolade is: 

  a.. the man's vision toward the world (democratic), 
  b.. the manner of his public demeanour and behaviour (savvy), and 
  c.. that the leader's feelings are about the commonweal, generally and usually.

     I suggest about Blair:   "His vision is democratic; his politics savvy; and his feelings are deeply rooted in the commonweal."

Would you care to address your thoughts about leadership standards of the world's leaders in these or other relevant terms?
Do you think using these terms there is a better elected leader on the planet's world stage? 

 I reference Roosevelt and Truman - both world players who killed many earthlings. 
Truman's use of the bomb is still a debate topic. 

We know life is transient. Listen to Blair yesterday in the midst of a visit from the dark side.  

Can political life be meaningful? Is cynicism functional?

Dublinjack

PS Thanks for correcting my typos

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ian" <ialterman at nyc.rr.com>
To: <mb-civic at islandlists.com>
Sent: Friday, July 08, 2005 1:23 AM
Subject: Re: [Mb-civic] Go easy on Blair

> Cheeseburger:
> 
> Although I believe it is possible to give a person credit for the "good" 
> things s/he does even if s/he is doing "bad" things as well, I must say 
> that, otherwise, I find myself in complete agreement with all your comments 
> here.  Extemely well-put.
> 
> Peace.
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Cheeseburger" <maxfury at granderiver.net>
> To: "mb-civic" <mb-civic at islandlists.com>
> Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2005 2:33 PM
> Subject: [Mb-civic] Go easy on Blair
> 
> 
> > Re:  Go easy on Blair
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > CheeseComment:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > =========
> > Chesseburger:
> >
> > Sorry you missed the forest for the tress!
> > ==========
> >
> >
> > I have a feeling I am still living within the heart of the forest looking
> > out at people like Bush, Blair, Putin, whomever,smiling for the cameras 
> > and
> > the Commonweal chopping it down with their political chainsaws faster than
> > God himself can replant it.
> >
> >
> >
> > ======
> > Tony Blair is simply the most effective and modern and reliable elected
> > politician in the world today.
> > =======
> >
> >
> > Blair backed the Bush-Cheney-Rumsfeld-Etc illegal murderous push into Iraq
> > like it was going out of style, lies, deceptions, bombs, and all.  Perhaps
> > he is truly "a great man and leader" at Home looking out for local British
> > interests, however there now sit several thousand dead American G.I.'s and
> > about 100,000 dead civilian men women and children Iraqis upon his 
> > personal
> > plate.  If that constitutes "modern and reliable politics in the world
> > today", you can keep him, and while you're at it take Bush, Cheney, and
> > Rumsfeld off our hands.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ======
> > His vision is democratic; his politics savvy; and his feelings are deeply
> > rooted in the commonweal.
> > =======
> >
> >
> > Again, while this might certainly apply to Local British Affairs,
> > internationally, and specifically now Iraq, he reminds me of nothing less
> > than a love child of Vladimir Putin and Dick Cheney.
> >
> >
> >
> > ======
> > How he came to wear the crown of British leadership for so many years; and
> > keeping an independent Scots man in charge of the economy and 
> > purse-strings
> > excites politicos.
> > =======
> >
> >
> > I am not a politico.  I am outside all their worlds, looking in on them 
> > with
> > a giant magnifying glass, and all the International Press I can gather on
> > their actions.  So far, to me personally, all his "good works at Home" 
> > don't
> > come close to his "Great Work" he has so bloodily accomplished at the
> > expense of a giant pile of dead bodies in Iraq.
> >
> >
> >
> > =====
> > He moved Labour away from its traditional base with unions into the
> > multiplex political centre where turbulence is constant - yet he
> > successfully leads a now-minority Anglo Saxon tradition within a polyglot 
> > UK
> > nation of 100 nationalities and 300 languages.
> > =======
> >
> >
> > Local British Affairs.  Not interested.  At least not at this exact 
> > specific
> > moment.  Even extreme tyrants are well-known to come Home, kiss their 
> > loving
> > wife, tuck their lovely children into bed, say their prayers, and then the
> > next morning get on the train and go out and help eliminate another 
> > 100,000
> > civilians in some far away inconsequential country.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > =====
> > He took a hit in popularity over the USA decisions involving Iraq where
> > (h)is role (was) politically strategic in a  long standing international
> > alliance.
> > ======
> >
> >
> > That is just too hard to actually stomach as a legitimate statement based 
> > in
> > reality with thousands of American G.I.s coming home from Iraq in body 
> > bags,
> > 100,000 civilian men women and children Iraqis murdered in cold blood, and
> > international quagmire that has cost the USA personally billions of wasted
> > dollars, our almost complete international reputation as a "sane global
> > leader", and utter mayhem and chaos in *our* Local Political Arena.
> >
> > Anyone who would dare explain it all away as "taking a hit in popularity" 
> > is
> > just obviously either not thinking very clearly about the entire matter, 
> > or
> > just too in awe of Blair to admit his own flaws which are now blatantly
> > apparent despite his "great works".
> >
> > This is not the first time that long standing international alliances and
> > politically strategy have cost 100's of thousands, or even millions of
> > innocent lives, in concocted wars pulled out of the arses of "The World's
> > Great Leaders".
> >
> > Nor will it apparently be the last at this rate of absorbtion of reality.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ===========
> > If you have the chance to view the surprisingly successful London
> > presentation to the OIC, that was only yesterday a 4-1 loser versus Paris,
> > and only last year a no-hope
> > chancer, you will gain some insight into the character of a modern spirit
> > liberator.
> >
> > The UK "legacy" idea presented, visually and with understated effect,
> > worked like the silk strands of a fine cloth, woven to clothe a fine 
> > idea -
> > for aesthetic impact.
> >
> > London would offer the OIC the opportunity to fashion and craft a legacy 
> > for
> > the young people of the world, through sport, that will endure into the
> > future. This statement was backed by the children on the committee - 
> > missing
> > were the business men. The presentation went on in language and symbol 
> > that
> > suits the short attention span of this modern world. The primary 
> > beneficiary
> > would be the world mission of the OIC itself.
> >
> > Chirac was talking about cuisine!
> >
> > Leadership like this recalls the savvy Roosevelt in the Great Depression -
> > who some say welcomed the Japanese invasion for the decision that was
> > already taken and planned. A decision only overshadowed by the decision of
> > Truman to end it, not with a whimper - but a bang.
> > ===========
> >
> >
> >
> > Pro-Blair propaganda.
> >
> > I barely have the stomach to give it a thorough reply.
> >
> > But just for a mild rebriefing, even a fine upstanding "leader" such as
> > Arnold Schwarzenneger was appointed by one of our "Fine Presidents" here 
> > as
> > some kind of "sports representative to all the children of America and the
> > world".
> >
> > He is now governor of California screwing anyone and everyone as fast as 
> > he
> > can.
> >
> > I have always disliked the fact that people often point to various
> > "Leader"'s benevolent actions such as "Look what he is doing for the
> > children!!" or "Look what he is doing for the poor starving Africans", 
> > while
> > completely ignoring what he just did for say thousands of dead American
> > G.I.s and 100,000 dead Iraqi civilian men women and children.
> >
> > The left hand is glowing with the light of redemption, benevolence, and
> > salvation.
> >
> > The right hand is still covered in dripping blood with a few childrens' 
> > body
> > parts dangling from its fingers.
> >
> > And never the twain shall meet in Heaven.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > =======
> > I sometimes enjoy your flippant commentary, but chesseburger, strengthen
> > yourself on 'som rosbif'.
> >
> >
> > Dublinjack
> > =========
> >
> >
> > I am glad that, now and then, I can be somewhat entertaining.
> >
> > Send lawyers, guns, and money, then I can buy some real rosbif.
> >
> > What is even more entertaining is that the youthful sportsmanlike 
> > appearance
> > of Leaders like Putin can actually turn the clock back a few centuries in
> > their own countries without being noticed by the common people who become
> > mysteriously dazzled by their fake charisma.
> >
> > What is even further entertaining than that, is that approximately 30
> > Percent of All Russian Youth now seriously believe that someone named 
> > Stalin
> > was one of the literal best Leaders ever to cross their nation's path.
> >
> > Although I might be completely incorrect, I'm still relatively convinced
> > that Blair is nothing more than a midnight love child of Putin and Cheney.
> >
> > With a pretty face, and with great words, but another midnight lovechild
> > nevertheless.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Cheeseburger
> >
> > .
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > Mb-civic at islandlists.com
> > http://www.islandlists.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mb-civic
> > 
> 
> 
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